Leftists supporting Putin are ‘idiots’, say anarchists from Ukraine
Within the Russian population there’s resistance against Vladimir Putin’s war. The Canary has tried to highlight this resistance by amplifying grassroots movements. Critically, it’s important that our ‘left’ alliances don’t result in us talking over voices on the ground in Russia.
Activists in the resistance describe themselves as anarchists, anarcho-syndicalists, anarchist-communists, or libertarian socialists/communists. Recent interviews with Russian – and Ukrainian – activists help provide an insight into the resistance, as well as into Putin’s Russia.
Russia or NATO?
Given Ukraine is backed by NATO, it’s not surprising if many on the left may adopt an ambivalent stance regarding the Russian invasion. But as the Canary’s own Joe Glenton said in an article published just 48 hours after that invasion:
It’s long past time for some of us to update our software on Russia/NATO antagonism.
Two Ukrainian anarchists – Anatoliy Dubovikhave and Sergiy Shevchenko – commented on that and other matters concerning the invasion. They were interviewed by Yavor Tarinski of the Greek libertarian journal Aftoleksi, republished in English by the London-based Freedom.
Dubovikhave and Shevchenko explained that they were members of Revolutionary Confederation of Anarchist-Syndicalists (in Russian, RKAS), which for many years was:
involved in the labour movement, the student movement, we had a significant influence on the independent trade union movement, especially among the Donbas miners, where RKAS representatives participated in local and regional strike committees. We participated in a pan-Ukrainian movement to protect workers’ rights and oppose the deterioration of labour legislation.
Read on...
After the Russian invasion of Ukraine, RKAS had to change tack, adopting armed resistance against the aggressors. Dubovikhave and Shevchenko also train volunteers in “unofficial military organizations, from which territorial defense units later emerged”. Moreover, within the Ukrainian armed forces, soldiers have set up anarchist committees.
They’re “idiots”
With regard to those on the left who support Putin, Dubovikhave and Shevchenko explain:
The left sees Putin’s Russia as an alternative to NATO, as a rival to NATO. In a sense, they are right: Russia is indeed opposed to NATO. But they do not see, and do not want to see, that the Russian alternative means only a desire to pursue its own, independent but equally (if not worse) imperialist policy.
They say such ‘leftists’ are “idiots”.
They add:
It suffices to say that throughout the existence of the independent Ukrainian state, there has not been a single political anarchist prisoner here. At the same time, many dozens of our comrades in Russia ended up in Russian prisons – guilty solely for their anarchist convictions.
But they remain optimistic, referring to a number of non-state self-organized initiatives in Ukraine:
They deal with a variety of issues, from helping refugees and guarding small communities to supplying the military with everything they need. In this sense, Ukraine today follows anarchist practices more than many other societies in the world.
Issues
Aftoleksi also published a video by film-maker and independent journalist Alexis Daloumis, who interviewed Russian, Ukrainian, Belarusian and Polish anarchists and anti-authoritarians. The main issues addressed include Russia’s claim that the invasion is about ‘denazification’, what’s really happening in Donbas, and the politics surrounding the involvement of NATO:
Revolutionary Action
Resistance by its nature comes in various forms. Back in March, the Canary reported that Ukrainian anarchists had set up an “international detachment to resist the Russian invasion”.
Freedom also published an interview the Polish 161 Crew did with a member of the Ukrainian Operation Solidarity (OS). OS was set up by anarchists and libertarian socialists to support anti-fascists, anti-authoritarian activists, and leftists in their armed struggle against the Russian occupation.
Like Dubovikhave and Shevchenko, OS made it clear why the left should not support Putin:
Putin calls his actions “denazification” and “anti-fascism” – that’s absolute bullshit. Anti-fascists don’t bomb children and old people, they don’t throw thermobaric bombs at civilians or use phosphorus, they don’t leave or burn the bodies of soldiers on purpose so as not to have to pay their families any money, they don’t use own people as cannon fodder. We don’t destroy cities and leave scorched ground.
The Canary has previously published details of mass anti-war protests, cyber attacks on Russian sites, and acts of sabotage.
History of struggle
Ukraine is no stranger to armed struggle and has a proud history of resisting totalitarianism. For example, anarchist insurrectionist Nestor Makhno led the 100,000 strong Revolutionary Insurgent Army of Ukraine (RIAU). The RIAU fought a campaign against the Bolsheviks in the aftermath of the Communist revolution.
In an article in CrimethInc, published before Putin’s invasion, Ukrainian anarchists provided a brief history of resistance in Ukraine. They pointed out how during the occupation of Crimea, Russian authorities detained and tortured several anarchists.
One anarchist group mentioned – Autonomnyi Opir (Autonomous Resistance) – was inspired by the Zapatistas (Mexican revolutionary anarchists) and the Kurds.
Prisoner support
Resistance invariably also means providing prisoner support. Autonomy is the website of Autonomy Action, an organisation of anarchists and libertarian communists that’s now in its 20th year. Since 2007, it has also hosted news and updates from the Moscow section of the Anarchist Black Cross (ABC). The latter provides support to prisoners, such as finding and paying for lawyers, supplying books and food packages, etc.
In September, Autonomy published an interview with Moscow ABC (who translated it into English). In that interview, Moscow ABC explained how some people are jailed for spreading ‘fakes’, i.e.:
the dissemination of any information about the actions of the Russian Armed Forces that differs from the official version.
Moscow ABC also assists Solidarity Zone, an initiative that provides a similar service to that of the ABC. In May, Autonomy published a list of anti-war prisoners supported by Moscow ABC.
Autonomy also provides updates on anti-war and anti-state prisoners. These include Belarusian anarchists charged on a number of offences, who were sentenced to 5 to 17 years, and the arrest and torture of anti-fascists in the Urals, variously accused of possession of weapons and explosives.
Another site, Rupression, offers prisoner support specifically on a case involving eight people who were arrested in 2017-18. They were accused of being part of a terrorist organisation and were viciously tortured.
The International Workers Association in Russia
In 1989, my partner and I – both members of the London ABC and the UK section of the anarcho-syndicalist International Workers Association (IWA) – took the risk of travelling to the Soviet Union to meet a group of people who wanted to set up a Russian section of the IWA.
As it was, it turned out to be a fruitful meeting. Some 33 years later, at the commencement of Putin’s invasion of Ukraine, the IWA in Russia issued a statement urging the Russian military to mutiny and Russian people to take strike action. Mutinies and acts of sabotage were subsequently reported, although there are no reports of strikes. Meanwhile, on-the-ground resistance against Putin’s imperialist aggression continues.
Featured image via YouTube
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There may be some on the left who supports Putin, however most on the left ‘are told that they support Putin’, if they don’t support the ACTUAL cilvillian killing Ukrainian Nazis! The Ukrainians Hate Russian Speaking Ukrainians, that is a fact just look at the extent of anti-Russian Language actons of the Ukraine Government.
Why would the Russians be killing the civillians they have come to protect from the Nazis and just voted to rejoin Russia!? Russia is on the frontline fighting in the direction of West Ukraine, out of Donbas, Ukraine is on the frontline fighting into Donbass, The Kindergartens, Schools, Nuclear Powerplant, The Bridge, The Hotels, The Flats, The Hospitals are all in the direction of the Frontline Fighting into Donbass! Their president makes gaffs about the bridge explosion, Kiev erected a giant stamp for selfies with the Bridge Exploding in the background! Well I reckon that I know who are the Fucking Monsters in this conflict! The filth killed 3 innocent people and they fucking celebrate with selfies!
What most peoples possibly even reading here is that international MSM are ONLY reporting from the West Ukrain side, why is the NO MSM reporting on the Russian Speaking Ukrainian side, is that not extremely concerning to people or should I say Sheeple!
Putin is a Conservative Party Leader of a federration, no different to Truss, BlueKeef and Biden they are all Thatcher/Reagan’s flavour of Globalist Neoliberals! Why would the Left “whorship” him!? The Left are merely less likely to believe the Propagandist MSM and Fake/Conspiracy Alternative media and more likely to dig deep for truth and perhaps even think a bit further than their noses’ are long! FFS WAKE UP! Sweden and Italy now has Far Right Government and Le Penn is about to kick Macron’s nearly far right, arse! Is now, well is any, but still now really a good time to support Nazis and Fascists!? I doubt The Left is anti-Ukrainian, just anti-Nazi and anti-Fascist Ukrainian, the left are aware that there are many lovely people on all sides of this conflict! With several Moscow redlines crossed the past few weeks Russia may well start war tactics, and end the Special Operation. That would be Horrific, but it will be over in days, why do people think it has taken Russia so bloody long, be clear on this its not because they are out of Military might, and now that Ukraine & USA have declared war by their actions things should change dramatically! Hopefully Peace Talks can begin ASAP! However I doudt there will be a budge on the new Russian Speaking Ukrainian Republics and as long as there are Russian Speaking Ukrainians and Nazis who kill them, so it should be!
Why are you carrying so much water for Russian propaganda?
What is Russian Propaganda?
Those are my own words and I am surprized Canary’s Editors did not pick up that that guy is literally a Stepan Bandera Ultranationalist Nazi, from the The Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists/OUN-B (Bandera/Nazis)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organization_of_Ukrainian_Nationalists
Your post is practically nothing but Russian propaganda, thude.
1) “the ACTUAL cilvillian killing Ukrainian Nazis!” No, it’s the Russians who have been slaughtering civilians in job lots, as evidenced by the constant discoveries of mass graves coming out of everywhere Ukraine liberates.
2) “Why would the Russians be killing the civillians they have come to protect from the Nazis and just voted to rejoin Russia!?” No, that’s the public excuse Putin gave for starting the war. The actual reasons have a great deal more to do with racist Russian ideas that Ukraine isn’t a ‘real’ country, general Russian imperialism, worries about NATO having more of a presence on the Russian border (which I might be sympathetic to if Ukraine hadn’t been learning toweards signing up with Nato because the alternative was Russia and its abuses), etc etc.
Like, Russia makes a lot of noise about the Azov Regiment, but as terrible as they are they’re a volunteer militia as part of Ukraine’s territorial defenses – they’re not part of the regular army or the government, and they fundamentally don’t MATTER. Russia, on the other hand, maintains the Wagner Group as a de-facto private army on Putin’s payroll with official support, which says a damn sight more about the character of the Russian army and government.
Also for that matter, ‘just voted to rejoin Russia’ is a bad joke considering how rigged those elections were.
3) ‘Russia is on the frontline fighting in the direction of West Ukraine, out of Donbas, Ukraine is on the frontline fighting into Donbass, The Kindergartens, Schools, Nuclear Powerplant, The Bridge, The Hotels, The Flats, The Hospitals are all in the direction of the Frontline Fighting into Donbass!’ Considering Russia hit a children’s hospital with a missile in the opening stages of the war, and have kept up a steady stream of collateral damage and civilian butchery ever since, this is pretty rich.
4) ‘Putin is a Conservative Party Leader of a federration, no different to Truss, BlueKeef and Biden they are all Thatcher/Reagan’s flavour of Globalist Neoliberals!’ Lol. Just… lol. Barring a brief blip in 2008-2012, Putin has been Russia’s head of state in one form or another since 1999, he’s a dictator in all but name.
5) ‘With several Moscow redlines crossed the past few weeks Russia may well start war tactics, and end the Special Operation. That would be Horrific, but it will be over in days, why do people think it has taken Russia so bloody long, be clear on this its not because they are out of Military might, and now that Ukraine & USA have declared war by their actions things should change dramatically!’ Thude, Russia has been using war tactics since the start, they’ve been sending in their best kit since day one and it’s been getting chewed up and spit out. There is no grand Russian scheme, okay? It has been taking so long because they’re losing hard, and all indications are that they will continue to lose hard.
I am afraid facts are not Propaganda, but you won’t find any of thatin the Western Manufactured MSM Propagandist War Machine!
@imrix : “Russia makes a lot of noise about the Azov Regiment, but as terrible as they are they’re a volunteer militia as part of Ukraine’s territorial defenses – they’re not part of the regular army or the government”
In November 2014, the regiment was officially enrolled into the National Guard of Ukraine.
As a result it received official funding from the Ukrainian Interior Ministry and other sources (believed to be Ukrainian oligarchs).
That sounds like they’re part of the state to me.
@red star : Fair enough, I was mistaken on the specifics of Ukraine’s territorial defense setup. Nevertheless, they’re still a militia group localised to one city without any special support or status. They still pale in comparison to the Wagner Group.
It’s worth remembering the Atlantic article from a few months back by a Ukranian journalist, Nataliya Gumenyuk, that describes Ukranian society’s outlook on their state as one of, ‘lingering ill will toward officials, combined with enthusiastic circumvention of the state to solve problems’. That outlook of seeing government as something to work around in order to do what needs doing to keep life going on the day-to-day has persisted, but the exigencies of war have basically forced the government to acknowledge and shake hands with the local ingenuity that drives it. It sounds like pretty fertile ground for anarchists, encouraging a ton of local organisations and mutual aid networks that, once the war is over, will be extremely difficult for any government to disrupt due to their entrenchment and patriotic glamour.
Interesting you should choose that particular article to paste I just watched an Ukrainian Nazi speaking in the same vein only with threats to the Ukrainian Government that they will be comming round to ‘visit’ post war, and no politeness included.
Is that who you support the Nazis?
Do you even hear yourself? I reference and quote another article about the empowerment of local organisation in Ukraine as part of this article about Ukranian anarchists, and how it constitutes reason to be hopeful for the future of Ukrainian society, and you come back with some wild-arse reference to some video supposedly of a Ukranian nazi threatening the government, as if I’m supposed to know what you’re talking about?
Yes, perhaps you forgot how the Nazis were “hopeful for the Ukrainian Society” in Odessa, by burning Russian Speaking Ukrainians as they watched! Coburgh may call Nazis “Anarchists” you can dess them up however you like, but A Nazi will be NOTHING other than, A Nazi!
Naivety is an extremely dangerous luxury that no one should afford themselves.
I was merely drawing your attention to what a young Nazi on the Frontline said about his politician, who knows mayde he is a “Anarchist” also.
Tragically too many of our species are bloodthirsty psychopaths. Human history is bloody and dominated by greed and conflict. There seems to be an insatiable appetite for this. Can’t see how this will ever change. We destroy one another and everything else. Planet is dying. Extinction will take us all sooner rather than later.
Why don’t you put your money where your American iPhone is and move to Russia? It sounds like it has everything you dream of.
Then report back from there, you could even set up a website as an alternative to the the Russian MSM.
Go for it.
Tumble weed……….
The ‘American iPhone’ is, of course, manufactured in that US enemy of enemies, the People’s Republic of China. Your riposte of ‘move to Russia’ could have been copied from a transcript of the anti-communist McCarthy hearings in the USA in 1954. Neither Russia nor the USA has a free media. In the USA, as here in the UK, most of it is corporate propaganda, including our BBC which happily took part in the campaign against the hapless Jeremy Corbyn in 2019.
Tumbleweed as expected.
Give Moscow a try for 12 months and report back how you like it’s media coverage and the FSB.
Or just carry on enjoying your life as a pseudo revolutionary keyboard warrior , enjoying your Dominos pizza delivery’s and not having to worry about national service.
Your hatred of Russians is blatant! Not to mention deeply worrying!
I’ve met Russians over the years and far from hate them, have invited their children on play dates with my children.
M suggestion is simply that you go and try your luck over in Russia given how much you detest the life you have here. It would be great to hear how it’s going and what we can learn from Putin’s approach to democratic rights, freedom of speech, the right to protest and of course mobilisation.
What difference does that make!? Do you mean that ‘you don’t hate Russians because you didn’t kill their children when you could have’? Perhaps the law had more yo do with that than your “Russian Love”!? Many Brits live very happy lives in Russia, you have MSM blinkers on. Do you honestly believe in the current climate very many places are any different to Russia most specially in “The West”.
It would be a good move for someone young to make as the economy is booming unlike the West and their suicide sanction missions. Anywhere heaped by Western Sanction now, will come out the winners at the end of this madness. Innovation and creativity will boom there while the West have brain drained their nations, bled them dry with boomerang suicide sanctions and nothing to offer the international market.
That is happening now and soon people will be begging for residence in BRICS+ you’d have to be blind beyond your MSM blinkers not to see that.
Why do people think The West are beacons of democracy!? Ah of course The Great White West, the people with the blond hair and blue eyes matter!
Nevermind the heinous War Crimes that they commit against the people with brown hair and brown skins!
Nevermind about Julian Assange slowly being Murdered in a max security British Prison, for exposing truth and facts!
It won’t be long before BRICS embassy queues are several blocks long.
That is my opinion and your persistence on people move to Russia to dare speak about Russia, to observe the Russophobia, the Governments and MSM lies and propaganda, etc is Racist/Xenophobic in itself if it is you, I am sure it is, then you’ve been saying that since at least 2015/whenever Canary started.
It’s not racist or xenophobic to be against a regime that is bombing, murdering , torturing and raping innocent civilians whilst you tap away on your luxury western phone.
Buy yourself a one way ticket to Moscow where you belong.
Spoken in pure Zombified MSM Sheeple tongue aka Luntzspeak or even Goebbelsspeak to be old fashioned.
Sent from my very cheap Chinese Phone, very cheap, but just as good, if not better than the best of any Great White Western Phones, made in China by Chinese.
The Facts and Truth are all burried all over Ukraine in mass graves and it won’t be long before all those “Russian” victims are identified and forensically examined then properly laid to rest side by side like in any other civilised Country, anywhere on earth, in whatever crsis, instead of dumped on piles from the back of a Tipper Truck like Rubbish at the Tip!
Their time to tell all will come!
As we well know the dead keep no secrets.
There we are Canary writers and readers. . Do you really want to be associated with such a Putin apologist?
Notice how he prefers to keep tapping away enjoying his European democratic freedom of speech completely dodging the question of moving to his beloved Russia to try his luck there.
The real question to Canary Readers here is do you really want to see Pro-Bandera-Nazi articles, by the Canary!?
First thing to say is that you don’t have to support either side.
Its not a case of “good versus bad”, more a case of “bad versus even worse”. The latter being Ukraine, known before this war as the most corrupt state in Europe, and they ain’t got no better since.
It also needs to be realised that Ukraine today is basically an American puppet state and has been since 2014, when Uncle Sam decided he didn’t like the then (democratically elected) government’s move towards a better relationship with Russia and instigated a coup. Which in turn ignited a civil war , which in turn resulted eventually in the Russian involvement.
The coup also opened the way for extreme right wing elements to take positions of power, another driving factor in the current situation. This in undeniable. Support Ukraine and you’re supporting an extreme right wing state. If you’re Ok with that, well, that’s fine I guess. Just so long as you recognise that.
We might also remember that 4 regions of Ukraine have voted to leave and join the Russian Federation instead (5 if you count Crimea several years ago). What does it say about a state when whole regions vote to leave and join the “enemy” ?
We should remember that Ukraine has been passing laws to diminish workers and trade union rights.
Also, Ukraine is pushing through a bill that will give the state virtually total control over all media. Amongst other things, it:
“contains a ban on publishing any messages contradicting the official government line on military issues. It is likewise forbidden to cover speeches made by officials of the ‘aggressor country’ [meaning Russia] or cast former USSR party functionaries in a positive light. For example, including Ukraine’s own Leonid Brezhnev.
“The law would also hold foreign media responsible for any of its audiovisual content available in Ukraine. Moreover, social networks, including foreign ones, will be obliged to remove any material the National Council deems undesirable. The deadlines for removing ‘incorrect’ content or replacing it with ‘correct’ material have also been tightened. Among the ‘offenses’ that can get a media outlet banned is distributing programs in which any participant is on the ‘list of persons who pose a threat to the national media space of Ukraine.’ ”
More details : https://libya360.wordpress.com/2022/10/09/ukraine-is-preparing-a-law-on-full-control-over-the-media-as-the-last-vestiges-of-press-freedom-disappear-in-kiev/
The Canary might like to take special note of this last point. It’ll be a case of “say what we tell you to say, or be blocked”. And maybe put on a list of enemies of the state….
Perhaps The Canary is getting in early to show the Ukrainian state that this website will publish only those articles that state deems to be ‘correct’.
“We might also remember that 4 regions of Ukraine have voted to leave and join the Russian Federation instead (5 if you count Crimea several years ago). What does it say about a state when whole regions vote to leave and join the “enemy” ?” That said enemy has a history of militarily occupying those areas and setting up rigged elections to manufacture consent, mainly.
How many reports have you viewed of the referendums? Not the staged MSM, nonsense?
Crimea 14years later, how many reports from people not happy with that ‘arrangement’?
Plenty of anti-Russia propaganda comes out so no it’s not because they are scared!
Russia was also supposed to have modile Crematoriums, based on a picture of a mobile agricultural cremation furnace big enough for a large lamb or 5/10 chickens, turkeys. etc. It is that level of ignorance of blindly believing the MSM misinformation without any thought, research or questioning that leaves millions dead!
I am sure everyone here are familiar with Blumenthal and as a Respected Journalist. Old but essential to understand the threat of Western MSM! Especially where the Rusian Speaking Ukrainians are concerned.
https://youtu.be/a4-1qhGvbu4
@Imrix : Rigged elections ? The international observers watching them didn’t think so. And, incidentally, the percentages in favour of leaving Ukraine were far bigger than the 51.8% of UK voters who were able to enable Brexit.
Now…. I see you haven’t yet tried to justify the attacks on trade union and workers rights. Or the crushing of any independent media. Isn’t that the sort of thing Russia is supposed to do ?
And many of those international observers were threatened with criminal charges on return to the EU!
I saw some horrific comments from fellow countrymen one particular was a Dutch woman and well it was alarming the hatred of Russians that this is causing. All thanks to our Great Western “Democracy” and the MSM Divission War-Machine, sick and twisted!
The penny is dropping and people are waking up to the real game that is being played.
Because I’m interested in truth, not carrying water for propaganda on either side. I haven’t read up on Ukraine’s conduct on trade union and workers rights, so until I do, I don’t comment on it.
I *have* read up on the annexation elections, and like – apart from that fact that yes, the international community, from Brazil through India, Slovakia, and even Turkey for all they’ve been buttering up both sides, decry the elections as a sham, also just on the face of it, results like 99% in favour simply does not happen in an actual democratic process. That is *textbook* ‘dictators telling voters what ballots to cast at gunpoint’ shit. I mean 52% of the turnout (not voters – the subset of the ~70% of UK voters who cast a ballot) voting Leave on what was supposed to be non-binding opinion poll is no democratic mandate to overturn the country, what the fucking tories have done is a disgrace, but 99% in favour is in no way a credible result of honest democratic will.
“Interested in the truth” the Great White Western MSM & MSSM Propaganda based “Truth”. Well that will serve you well.
There are no excuse for ignorance to truth and reality, not in the age of instant Information even if you have to peel back several layers to get to it.
You won’t find truth from MSM or MSSM, even if you think you have, you should still peel back the layers to confirm to yourself! Isn’t it interesting that there are no reports from the international observers making your wild accusations.
Even more telling that none of the Russian speaking Ukrainians are being heard of in the Great White Western MSM, you know the ones with white armbands, the forgotten Ukrainians not the Ukrainian speaking Russian Hating Ukrainians, who kill them, we hear plenty from them.
You reckon that you don’t carry ‘water’ and “Propaganda” from either side yet your rhetoric is entirely of Russophobia.
@Imrix : “… . I haven’t read up on Ukraine’s conduct on trade union and workers rights, so until I do, I don’t comment on it.”
If you’ve really been following events in Ukraine, its a bit difficult to see how you’ve missed it. Unless of course you restrict yourself to the western MSM for information.
@Imrix : “… results like 99% in favour simply does not happen in an actual democratic process.”
No ? Perhaps if those voting have, since the coup of 2014, have been on the receiving end of Ukraine’s military action and the brutality of your mates in Azov, Kraken and the rest of the neo-nazi bully boys… perhaps if you see no future for yourself as a ethnic Russian, except as a target… perhaps then you might well get results like 99%.
“…more than a hundred foreign observers from 40 countries, excluding specialists from Russia, attending the referenda in the Lugansk and Donetsk people’s republics, as well as in the Zaporozhye and Kherson regions, on joining the Russian Federation, reported no violations, with the exception of threats and shelling from Ukraine.”
https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/lpr-dpr-kherson-and-zaporozhye-vote-for-reunification-with-r
Perhaps when your elections are under threats of violence, and actual violence, from the state you’re voting whether to stay with, that too might decide which way you cast your vote.
But then, as with the other less palatable bits of what’s going on (workers rights, media) I expect you won’t have read about that either. And if you haven’t read about it, it can’t possibly be happening, right ?
Can the both of you quit tilting at windmills assuming anybody who’ll read this is only interested in western MSM? If that was where I got all my news, I wouldn’t be reading the *Canary,* lol.
To pick out a couple points:
“There are no excuse for ignorance to truth and reality, not in the age of instant Information even if you have to peel back several layers to get to it.”
Sure there is, it’s called information overload. Finding information is easy these days, assessing its accuracy amid the great sea of sources, not so much. I mean the both of you are literally exhorting people to not trust wide swathes of news media, you should be well familiar with this already.
“Perhaps when your elections are under threats of violence, and actual violence, from the state you’re voting whether to stay with, that too might decide which way you cast your vote.”
I mean the 2014 coup was, as you say, a coup, a Russian-backed annexation where they did much as they’re doing now, just with less reaction from the world stage, so it’s not like Russia *hasn’t* been threatening and using violence. They launched a whole invasion to do it, complete with bombing children’s hospitals in the first few days. But they were the ones exercising military control over the regions holding the votes, so I find it much more credible that such wildly lopsided results are simply from Russian troops bullying and murdering the populace into toeing the party line, rather than the populace taking such exception to Ukraine fighting a defensive war against imperialist invaders to reclaim them.
Like you want to talk about brutality, Ukraine aren’t the ones committing massacres at Bucha and giving overt commands to kill civilians across the country.
Oh boy! Uber deluded! Information overload is rarely an issue outside of the mainstream. You must be suffering Information Overload Selective Amnesia Syndrome, because you seem to speak only of the MSM narative and nothing else. The MSM has been proven wrong on many occasions and it just drifts away like a vapour and a case of severe memory loss!
Your insistence that we are silenced and move away, because our view of the truth which is total opposite of your Manufactured MSM Propaganda is verging on Fascism! All you and the are doing is keeping the Great White West War Machine going and feeding Ukraine with Hate and more suicide mission weapons. As we have seen, the past couple of days, Russia has been selfrestrained prior, and warned Ukraine since February, since bloody 2014, you reckon Ukrain should carry on hating and killing Russians and Russian speaking Ukrainians, and MSM should continue antagonising Russia it is insane! We have not seen anything of what Russia is capable of and the likes of you jeering, crowing and cheering each time Truss, BlueKeef, Biden, EU, NATO, UN, etc speak in tones of aggression, well you are all fkn nuts!
Sadly that ‘Told You So’ will lie in piles of ashes accross a desolate land!
About Bucha! I mentioned Bucha in one of my messages and those dead people piled up on the back of a Tipper Truck and dumped on a pile like rubbish at the tip are all waiting to tell their stories! The TRUTH and the Facts will come out if those mass graves!
There are more than 25 Funeral Homes/Undertakers, more than 20 Universities, more than 25 Forensic Facilities, Bucha is home to the Main Municipal Graveyard of Kiev!
Tell me in what universe do you dump even your enemies onto a pile of corpses from the back of a Tipper Truck like Rubbish at the tip!
Never mind that they were your fellow Ukrainians who fell to the “Russians” war dead civilians, your friends and neighors from Bucha, ironically all Ukrainians who were wearing a White Armband. I could not dump a pile of dead stray dogs and cats in such a desturbing manner, could you!?
Not to mention all those facilities ideally located to at least arranging the manufacturing of pine coffins to forensics identify and lay the bodies to rest side by side and respectfully stacked.
The heartbreaking thing, to me, is that from a 100+ bodies the MSM would normally fall over themselves for relatives, the police would have to hold crowds of worried Family
/Spouses, Children back because they saw a picture of their wife, nanna, dad, brother identified by the clothes they went out with this morning, where was all that, but those people dumped like trash are covered in a veil of silence, their friends and families would not dare to report them missing or vome looking for them, because the would fill up the next mass grave, this is my own oppinion from observations of humanity and one that several independents also noted, about Bucha, but if you are happy with your own fallen civillians dumped onto a pile like rubish off the back of a Tipper Truck, bodies rolling down, bodies landing in awkward positions, instead of laid to rest respectfully and with dignity, then I hope that I am not anywhere the same town as you come the enemy.
Hear! Hear!
Even if we only take one concern and that being the MSM of the West being propagandised by Government to suit their specific naratives, fk me, is that not plenty enough worrying. This is not the first time where Tom Published a False narative playing directly into the MSM Russophobic, blind to Nazis Hysterics!
The EU, UK have their citizens on their knees for lies and bullshit, and the MSM Sheeple just lap it up and can’t see the woods for the trees! It frightens me.
So let me get this straight, does anyone believe we have “democratic rights, freedom of speech, the right to protest” in this country….wow. That’s unbelievable.
-“Rights” are given, and can be taken away just as quickly.
-You have no “freedom of speech”, apart from the line approved by the state and BBC/MSM/ITV/Sky. If you disagree with the COVID response, or “man-made climate change”, you are classed as a “dangerous fool” or “climate change denier” or worse.
-You have no “right to protest”, apart from those approved by the police.